[camerart]

Hi,
I would like to be a private person as much as I can, but hear that newer vehicles send DATA back to their manufacturers, and I would like to avoid this.

If the vehicle tells me that there is something wrong, contact the manufaturer, then I'm free to do so.

If this is true, then how can it be switched off, so the vehicle works as vehicles used to do>

I'm thinking about buying a new/ish electric vehicle.
Cheers, Camerart

[Santa]

I think that this is a fact of modern life. It's not only electric cars that collect data, all modern cars do it.

Almost everything we do these days shows up on a database somewhere. Drive on a motorway or trunk road and cameras with ANPR are tracking you. Go to a supermarket and even if you don't use a loyalty card, your actions are constantly tracked. Buy something online and the transaction goes into a database.

What is done with that data is open to question, but, in the UK at least, the Data Protection Act 2018 gives us quite effective protection. I decided a long time ago that trying to be anonymous in the 21st century requires far too much effort.

[NMNeil]

Step one is to disable the Bluetooth from your phone. Strange but if you connect to the Bluetooth that's in the car via your phone it immediately downloads all the data from the car and transmits it to the car manufacturer, and all the time the phone and car are linked it will keep doing it.
Unsurprisingly other are concerned about all this data gathering so it was inevitable that someone who develop a counter to the issue. No idea if it will work in the UK.
https://privacy4cars.com/personal-use/
I'm not sure where the transmitter is in the car that will send out all the data, maybe the body control module, or a dedicated box of tricks. Find it and wrap copper mesh round it taking care to ground the copper to the car's body (Faraday cage)

[Beelzebub]

Originally Posted by NMNeil

Step one is to disable the Bluetooth from your phone. Strange but if you connect to the Bluetooth that's in the car via your phone it immediately downloads all the data from the car and transmits it to the car manufacturer, and all the time the phone and car are linked it will keep doing it.
Unsurprisingly other are concerned about all this data gathering so it was inevitable that someone who develop a counter to the issue. No idea if it will work in the UK.
https://privacy4cars.com/personal-use/
I'm not sure where the transmitter is in the car that will send out all the data, maybe the body control module, or a dedicated box of tricks. Find it and wrap copper mesh round it taking care to ground the copper to the car's body (Faraday cage)

So, is the data sent from the phone, or from the (alleged) hidden transmitter?

If it's the former, then it must be using up the owner's data allowance, at his cost. I'd have thought that at least one of the squillions of car owners worldwide would have checked that and raised the alarm.

If it's the latter, what medium does it use to contact the manufacturer? And why are the phone and Bluetooth involved in the process at all?

[camerart]

Originally Posted by Santa

I think that this is a fact of modern life. It's not only electric cars that collect data, all modern cars do it.

Almost everything we do these days shows up on a database somewhere. Drive on a motorway or trunk road and cameras with ANPR are tracking you. Go to a supermarket and even if you don't use a loyalty card, your actions are constantly tracked. Buy something online and the transaction goes into a database.

What is done with that data is open to question, but, in the UK at least, the Data Protection Act 2018 gives us quite effective protection. I decided a long time ago that trying to be anonymous in the 21st century requires far too much effort.

Hi S,
I agree with most of what you say, but I try in various ways to limit it as much as possible, this is why I want to disable as much as I can what the vehicle needs to know.
I can drive around in the country side, go for a walk with my phone off, and nobody knows where I am.
C

[camerart]

Originally Posted by NMNeil

Step one is to disable the Bluetooth from your phone. Strange but if you connect to the Bluetooth that's in the car via your phone it immediately downloads all the data from the car and transmits it to the car manufacturer, and all the time the phone and car are linked it will keep doing it.
Unsurprisingly other are concerned about all this data gathering so it was inevitable that someone who develop a counter to the issue. No idea if it will work in the UK.
https://privacy4cars.com/personal-use/
I'm not sure where the transmitter is in the car that will send out all the data, maybe the body control module, or a dedicated box of tricks. Find it and wrap copper mesh round it taking care to ground the copper to the car's body (Faraday cage)

Hi N,
I've saved the interesting link for later, thanks.

I understand a bit about transmitters, and wrapping in a shield. Also I'm sure I could find the GPS and cut a track of the electronics or similar, but wonder if anything like this voids warrantees?

I use my phone mostly without DATA on, only the SIM, for texts and calls, and use the DATA for wifi and computers, or the occasional phone check.
C.

[camerart]

Originally Posted by Beelzebub

So, is the data sent from the phone, or from the (alleged) hidden transmitter?

If it's the former, then it must be using up the owner's data allowance, at his cost. I'd have thought that at least one of the squillions of car owners worldwide would have checked that and raised the alarm.

If it's the latter, what medium does it use to contact the manufacturer? And why are the phone and Bluetooth involved in the process at all?

Hi B,
I hope it's your personal phone, as I won't have mine on, or connected to the vehicle. I was told that the vehicles have their own SIM, which is sponsored by the manufacturer, I hope not!
C.

[camerart]

Originally Posted by Beelzebub

So, is the data sent from the phone, or from the (alleged) hidden transmitter?

If it's the former, then it must be using up the owner's data allowance, at his cost. I'd have thought that at least one of the squillions of car owners worldwide would have checked that and raised the alarm.

If it's the latter, what medium does it use to contact the manufacturer? And why are the phone and Bluetooth involved in the process at all?

Hi B,
It may depend on the make/model of vehicle, but I've found out that some have modems/sims buried in the vehicle.
C

[Rolebama]

Some cars not only keep a record of driving, but also any voice commands. It's not a great stretch to think they are also recording all conversations in the car.

[Santa]

Never mind cars. What about mobile phones, smart TVs, Alexa and her siblings, not to mention smartwatches?

How much information does the RAC get when you register here? What about all the data stores collect whenever you buy something online?

Your computer stores all kinds of data about sites you visit and searches you make. Even if you clear out the history and cookies, your IPA and whatever search engine you use keep records.

[Beelzebub]

Originally Posted by camerart

Hi B,
It may depend on the make/model of vehicle, but I've found out that some have modems/sims buried in the vehicle.
C

Which makes/models? Any evidence?

[Beelzebub]

Originally Posted by Rolebama

Some cars not only keep a record of driving, but also any voice commands.

Do you have a source for that?

[camerart]

Originally Posted by Santa

Never mind cars. What about mobile phones, smart TVs, Alexa and her siblings, not to mention smartwatches?

How much information does the RAC get when you register here? What about all the data stores collect whenever you buy something online?

Your computer stores all kinds of data about sites you visit and searches you make. Even if you clear out the history and cookies, your IPA and whatever search engine you use keep records.

Hi S,
I have a smart tv, but it's not connected apart from the antenna.

Yes, I understand that my data is being gleaned, all of the time, but I do all I can to lessen it as much as possible, hence this thread.
C

[camerart]

Originally Posted by Rolebama

Some cars not only keep a record of driving, but also any voice commands. It's not a great stretch to think they are also recording all conversations in the car.

Hi R,
I won't have a listening Alexa type thing in the house, I can switch the lights on myself, the exercise is good.

I think we would be surprised at what we find out, if we look. I keep being surprised.
C

[camerart]

Originally Posted by Beelzebub

Which makes/models? Any evidence?

Hi B,
I'm looking for what I can find from as many models as I'm interested in buying, before I buy.

If you have time, you have to search for sources for as many places as possible. I found some youtube videos, that show vehicle interrogation with results. Here's a screen shot from one video, showing phone contacts and email addresses. This leads to contacts getting spam, from seamingly nowhere.
C.

[NMNeil]

Originally Posted by Beelzebub

So, is the data sent from the phone, or from the (alleged) hidden transmitter?

If it's the former, then it must be using up the owner's data allowance, at his cost. I'd have thought that at least one of the squillions of car owners worldwide would have checked that and raised the alarm.

If it's the latter, what medium does it use to contact the manufacturer? And why are the phone and Bluetooth involved in the process at all?

You link a Bluetooth device to your cars Bluetooth, it downloads just about everything from your phone, or any other Bluetooth enabled device, that's where Bluetooth comes into it.
And manufacturers like Toyota even require you to agree to this data collection and transmission to Toyota when you buy or lease a car.
https://www.wired.com/story/car-data...ta-honda-ford/
It's switched on by default but you can ask for it to be disabled, but seemingly not all of it. " You can choose to opt-out of Connected Services. You can also request deactivation of data transmission, which disables our collection and use of vehicle data and certain account information."
So do you take your car into the dealership to have it deactivated or is it done remotely?
https://www.toyota.com/privacyvts/

[Rolebama]

Beelzebub: Only anecdotal from friends who worked for four well-known manufacturers. (Three office workers and a technician.) Will happily DM you if required.

[NMNeil]

Microchip is one of the world leaders in microcontrollers and other chips, here's their products to transmit data from cars, and they also transmit data to other cars 🤔
https://www.microchip.com/en-us/solutions/automotive-and-transportation/automotive-products/connectivity/ethernet

And, although the actual recording of a cell phone conversation is still potentially illegal the recording of text messages and cell phone call logs isn't, well here anyway.
https://therecord.media/class-action...ssages-privacy

So it's not a tinfoil hat issue, it's been reality for a while now.

[Mark07]

Any voice control device (including a car), must always be 'listening' in order to 'hear' the wake words/commands.

I expect companies will be generating reports on words that the devices hear in the background as these could potentially inspire new features.

I don't expect this data will track back to individuals though.

[Santa]

Originally Posted by Mark07

Any voice control device (including a car), must always be 'listening' in order to 'hear' the wake words/commands.

My car's voice control requires me to press a button on the steering wheel to wake it up.

[camerart]

Originally Posted by Mark07

Any voice control device (including a car), must always be 'listening' in order to 'hear' the wake words/commands.

I expect companies will be generating reports on words that the devices hear in the background as these could potentially inspire new features.

I don't expect this data will track back to individuals though.

Hi M,
I've seen odd bit of information, regarding our information, and what 'they' are capable of, and wonder what bits I haven't seen.
I don't like it, as I come from a history of adventure, and freedom, when nobody knew where I was, and I kind of like it.
C.

[camerart]

Originally Posted by Santa

My car's voice control requires me to press a button on the steering wheel to wake it up.

Hi M,
And do you press is as ordered, or just pull it out of it's socket :) 'joking'
C

[camerart]

Originally Posted by Beelzebub

So, is the data sent from the phone, or from the (alleged) hidden transmitter?

If it's the former, then it must be using up the owner's data allowance, at his cost. I'd have thought that at least one of the squillions of car owners worldwide would have checked that and raised the alarm.

If it's the latter, what medium does it use to contact the manufacturer? And why are the phone and Bluetooth involved in the process at all?

Hi B,
I'm not sure about different models, but the addition of a connected SIM, fitted somewhere in the car is being adopted by ever increasing manufacturers as you DATA is money to them, and why miss out. It is paid for by the manufacturers, at least for a while, which is balanced by the DATA sale.
C

If you phone is connected, then CAN BE listened to and read, then sent home. I've seen a list of phone numbers and email addresses that were sent.